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| Чт, Мар 24, 2011 01:07pm Ох - 4789 d back | ↑↓ |
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Health Care in the US vs health care in France, from someone who knows because he has experienced first hand both systems
I understand those in the US are listening to heated debates about healthcare, reform, and “socialized” medicine. I won’t add another boring polemic on the subject, I’ll just tell a little story of getting sick while on vacation, going to a doctor and a pharmacy, and not waiting in line or paying special fees for not seeing my “primary” doctor.
I live in France. I am covered by the French sécurité sociale. When I visit the doctor I call my doctor and make an appointment. Usually I can get an appointment within 2-3 days. It is at his private office, not some imaginary government run clinic with lines 300 weeks long.
I pay 22€ for a doctor visit, 17€ is reimborsed by Secu, directly sent to my account within 2-3 days of my visit. No forms to fill out, no hoping my insurance company is going to fully cover something, at the doctors office I give him my carte vitale, he swipes it, and all the necessary info is there. If I kept my mutuelle, private insurance supplement, it would reimborse another 4€ bringing the cost of going to the doctor to 1€.
For my prescriptions I go to any pharmacy I want, not some imaginary “government run” pharmacy with lines 300 weeks long. In fact, the pharmacies in France are really nice, clean, efficient, friendly, helpful, PROFESSIONAL, not like Walgreen, Walmart, Rite Aid style US pharmacies.
I show my carte vitale and then I only pay the amount not covered by Secu. My doctor already knows which medications are reimboursed or not so I generally know in advance how much it will cost. Most medications seem to be covered, unless you have serious illnesses, I have rarely paid for a prescription. On top of this, since the system is not rigged by pharmaceutical companies, everything that is not covered costs less than it does in the states, example with real numbers later.
SO, I went to the Atlantic Coast last week for the week. I had a terrible stomach, gastro, flu, sickness thing. No idea what it was, but I was sick all week. Last Tuesday I decided to go to the doctor, I didn’t know how this was going to work because I was so used to having to see my primary doctor and if not then paying more for seeing someone else. Here’s what happened.
I went to the local pharmacy to explain my symptoms and ask for advice, yes they actually give it in French pharmacies. I took some over the counter medicine they recommended but the next day I still felt bad. I went back to ask for a doctor recommendation.
They gave me the name of a doctor, located just above the pharmacy. It was during his office hours where no appointments are needed. I went into his private office, not some “government run” clinic with lines 300 weeks long. He saw me in less than 5 mintues of waiting. He asked a bunch of questions and prescribed some medicine. He swiped my carte vitale, I paid 22€, and went to the pharmacy to pick up the medicine.
1 day later the 17€ was back in my account. I didn’t have to explain why I didn’t go to my primary doctor, pay more, or fill out some form that I had to submit to my insurance company and pray they cover a routine doctor visit, all of which I have had to do when i lived in the US and had “private” insurance. Really a routine doctor visit, it just happened while I was on vacation, why shouldn’t it be treated the same as a regular visit? Why would it cost more? Why should it be more complicated?
So back to the pharmacy. He prescribed 4 medications for me. I went back to the pharmacy, just under his office, waited like 3 minutes in line. When the pharmacist brought all the medications to me, really another 3 minutes, not that excruciating 45 minute minimum wait in US pharmacies, she was a little worried. She said to me, 3 are covered and 1 is not, would you still like the one that is not covered? It made me worry, thinking about how expensive medicine can be, but I was really sick and said yes. I paid a grand total of 8€, 4 prescriptions, and 1 that is not reimbursed at all by Secu. It was any old pharmacy, I could have gone anywhere. I gave my carte vitale and that was it. I didn’t have to submit any forms to be reimbursed, I just paid the difference, 8€.
Really, going to the doctor, while sick, while on vacation, in a different city, region, and not referred by my primary doctor, and getting prescriptions, took all less than 30 minutes, involved NO special paperwork, in fact none at all, and no special permissions, no complications, AND it cost exactly the same as it would have cost had I been in Toulouse visiting my own doctor and regular pharmacy. For the French this is only normal, for people used to the US style of things, not so normal.
This is the basic coverage all people in France have, employed or not. Please stop trying to conjure up images of Soviet Style waiting lines and “government run” facilities. In countries where healthcare works well, that is not what happens.
I am self employed and do not earn a lot of money. I pay a percentage of my income in taxes to pay for my healthcare. Honestly, I don’t think it is that much more than I paid in the US, if you count the taxes I paid, and the cost of the health insurance plan, and the little expenses of having such an inefficient healthcare system. It may be even less.
I can see where earning a lot of money would significantly increase the taxes you pay here in France. That I think is the difference. In the US everyone thinks they will be rich some day, and when they are they wouldn’t want to pay so much in taxes, so to protect their possibly rich futures, they don’t want to do anything to increase taxes now. I guess it doesn’t matter that most of them will never be rich like they imagined so they should have opted for something sensible like healthcare. People constantly act against their interests, why should this still surprise me?
I don’t know if this is still a part of the debate, but when this debate last happened, I remember hearing “I don’t want a suit to decide for me”, well I’d prefer a person in a doctor’s suit making decisions for me than a person in a business suit making decisions for me.
Before demonizing a system, it might be a good idea to know how it really works.
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| Чт, Мар 24, 2011 01:23pm Дед Пихто - 4789 d back | ↑↓ |
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Ай ем вери вери хеппи фор ю, май деар фрог итер. Бат ды квещен оф; ХУ ВЫЛ ПЕЙ фор сач вандерфул енд джойфул експириенс??? из стил стендс......еспешали афтер ай хевв рид дыс; This is the basic coverage all people in France have, employed or not.
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| Чт, Мар 24, 2011 01:24pm Reina - 4789 d back | ↑↓ |
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Hmm, sounds like vaccines for travel which aren't medically necessary......so, it's understandible that they wouldn't pay.
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| Чт, Мар 24, 2011 01:26pm Дед Пихто - 4789 d back | ↑↓ |
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$400 за прививки (страховкой не покрываются) (ц)
А чево ето страховка должна покрывать твои прививки? Етож не страховка тебя на Кубу посылает правда? Сама захотела, сама плати.
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| Чт, Мар 24, 2011 01:28pm гражданка - 4789 d back | ↑↓ |
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да я не возражаю против того, что страховка не покрывает. но $100 за одну прививку - это просто свинство.
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| Чт, Мар 24, 2011 01:29pm гражданка - 4789 d back | ↑↓ |
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кстати, я не на кубу еду уже 
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| Чт, Мар 24, 2011 01:36pm Reina - 4789 d back | ↑↓ |
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А как на Кубу собиралась? Туда же нельзя 
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| Чт, Мар 24, 2011 01:38pm гражданка - 4789 d back | ↑↓ |
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я по религиозной линии собиралась, но передумала
кстати, из чикаго тоже есть эти религиозные поездки
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| Чт, Мар 24, 2011 01:38pm Дед Пихто - 4789 d back | ↑↓ |
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Согласен што цены, жутко взвинчены, поетому нужен комплекс мер их регулируюший.........но к обамакер ето не имеет НИКОВА отношения.
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| Чт, Мар 24, 2011 01:38pm Reina - 4789 d back | ↑↓ |
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Прививки по определению дорогая штука...представь, выработать вирус, модифицировать...итд.
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| Чт, Мар 24, 2011 01:39pm Дед Пихто - 4789 d back | ↑↓ |
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хммм, а кудаж ето такие прививки нужны дорогие.......теряюсь в догадках........Индия?
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| Чт, Мар 24, 2011 01:39pm Reina - 4789 d back | ↑↓ |
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Ой, Дед...а какие меры например и КТО будет их внедрять? С этого момента поподробней плиз.
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| Чт, Мар 24, 2011 01:41pm Дед Пихто - 4789 d back | ↑↓ |
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представь, выработать вирус, модифицировать...итд (ц)
Я не тока представляю, я точно ЗНАЮ, как именно ето делаеца  поетому и заявляю - ВЗВИНЧЕНЫ! Почему взвинчены тоже знаю.
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| Чт, Мар 24, 2011 01:41pm гражданка - 4789 d back | ↑↓ |
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рейна, этим прививкам уже 100 лет в обед. ничего нового они не изобрели. просто цены взвинтили.
а если я их не сделаю, предположим, и привезу домой какую-нибудь заразу? я же тут перезаражаю людей, и страховки будут оплачивать их лечение.
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| Чт, Мар 24, 2011 01:42pm гражданка - 4789 d back | ↑↓ |
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дед, я еду в перу (включая джунгли)
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| Чт, Мар 24, 2011 01:44pm Дед Пихто - 4789 d back | ↑↓ |
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Запросто:
1. Надо ввести ограничения на суммы судебных исков к фармацевтическим кампаниям, как ето уже сделано с госпиталями.
2. Надо стимулировать производителя (текс катс)
3. Надо ослабить хватку FDA на ево (производителя) шее. Вы будете смеяца но 70% от затрачиваемых средств и времени уходит на всевозможные проверки таво што уже было проверено 1000000 РАЗ!!!
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| Чт, Мар 24, 2011 01:47pm Reina - 4789 d back | ↑↓ |
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Дааа....интересно во сколько ты оцениш жизнь человека?
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| Чт, Мар 24, 2011 01:48pm Дед Пихто - 4789 d back | ↑↓ |
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Вот ты любиш искать себе на ж....у приключений. Ты вкурсе што Перу антиамериканская страна? Там у власти индеец каторый Чавеса в анус целует.
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| Чт, Мар 24, 2011 01:50pm Дед Пихто - 4789 d back | ↑↓ |
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интересно во сколько ты оцениш жизнь человека? (ц)
Жизнь человеческая бесценна........сума компенсаций за её утерю по вине третьих лиц не должна превышать 1-2 милионафф.
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| Чт, Мар 24, 2011 01:51pm Дед Пихто - 4789 d back | ↑↓ |
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+ ети деньги не должны облагаца налогом.
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| Чт, Мар 24, 2011 01:51pm Reina - 4789 d back | ↑↓ |
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Вау....ты так решил?? If they screwed up on such a grand scale, they should pay and it's up to the court to decide how much, not you.
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| Чт, Мар 24, 2011 01:55pm Дед Пихто - 4789 d back | ↑↓ |
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Ну вот. А патом ты кричиш о том што цена медицины заоблачая.
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| Чт, Мар 24, 2011 01:57pm Дед Пихто - 4789 d back | ↑↓ |
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If they screwed up on such a grand scale, they should pay (c)
никто же н говорит што они не будут платить, но зачем выводит при етом компанию из бизнеса?
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| Чт, Мар 24, 2011 01:59pm Reina - 4789 d back | ↑↓ |
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Не надо...разные вещи...ты хочешь помочь фарм компаниям легче жить и не так трястись о качестве своей продукции как трясуться сейчас. А как нащет того, что у них огромные профит марджинс...ничего? Тебя этот факт не трогает?
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| Чт, Мар 24, 2011 02:00pm Reina - 4789 d back | ↑↓ |
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 ...какая компания вышла из бизнесса? Pfizer? Merck? Bristol-Meyers Squibb?
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| Чт, Мар 24, 2011 02:06pm гражданка - 4789 d back | ↑↓ |
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дед, да пускай целует. я, кстати, лечу через венесуэлу и даже думала выйти из аэропорта, но начиталась ужасов и передумала
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| Чт, Мар 24, 2011 02:13pm Дед Пихто - 4789 d back | ↑↓ |
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какая компания вышла из бизнесса? (ц)
Реина, ети не выйдут, НО....не знаю или ты в курсе или нет, но все вышеперечисленые Бегемоты уже давным давно ничево не разрабатывают, они тока репекеджают и делают маркетинг. Для Р&Д есть маленькие никому не известные европейские кампахи каторые именно етим занимаюца. Так вот штоб ты знала бремя выплат ложица и на ети кампахи (в зависимости от контрайта ето ливо 50/50 либо 60/40), каторых по етому самаму поводу становица всё меньше и меньше.
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| Чт, Мар 24, 2011 02:15pm Дед Пихто - 4789 d back | ↑↓ |
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да пускай целует (ц)
Ну да, а завтра етим уродам понадобяца очередные заложники для их грязных игр.......и вот вам нате, гражданка со товарисчи, сами едут в руки, как удобно.
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| Чт, Мар 24, 2011 02:31pm гражданка - 4789 d back | ↑↓ |
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не знаю нащёт европейских компах, а у меня в госпитале р&д идёт полным ходом.
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| Чт, Мар 24, 2011 02:45pm Дед Пихто - 4789 d back | ↑↓ |
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и чо они в госпитале Р&Диют?
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| Чт, Мар 24, 2011 03:04pm гражданка - 4789 d back | ↑↓ |
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да много чего, включая заказы от фармацевтических компаний, от штата и федерального правительства, плюс какие-то собственные исследования. у нас целый рисёрч департмент.
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